how long is the service life of a laptop/macbook

hi I am running on i5, 4GB x 2 RAM, 1T HDD Windows 7 Home Premium with my current desktop PC, doing the same thing as I said, No game, no photoshop, no video work and nothing heavy, I am sometimes experiencing system crash and lag, I clean installed the windows not long ago, is that mean i5 and 8GB RAM may not be enough for me?? or is my desktop hardware failing or not well installed?? I am using a case with cable management and I only have one case fans, is that enough??

Maybe you are experiencing RAM or hard drive failures.

Check RAM with Memtest86 for several hours (free edition is fine): http://www.memtest86.com/download.htm

Check HDD with appropriate diagnostic program from your HDD manufacturer: http://www.computerforum.com/211596-list-hard-drive-diagnostic-utilities-test-your-drive.html
 
You just said that heat wouldn't cause significant lifetime decrease, but gamers take necessary steps to keep their systems cool. I wonder why that is...
Because most overclock, where temperatures are the limiting factor. If you don't overclock, heat isn't much of a concern.
 
Hi Could anyone help look at the following spec in the picture

This is IdeaPad S410 (i5) and I can get it at approx. USD 666 here, a student offer. Is such configuration at this price a great deal for laptop??

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Because most overclock, where temperatures are the limiting factor. If you don't overclock, heat isn't much of a concern.

Overclocking decreases the life of the computer, that's common knowledge. Yes, putting on a really nice custom loop will lower the heat hugely, maintaining the life of the chip, but the power draw the chip now requires still has a significant negative impact on its life.
 
Overclocking decreases the life of the computer, that's common knowledge. Yes, putting on a really nice custom loop will lower the heat hugely, maintaining the life of the chip, but the power draw the chip now requires still has a significant negative impact on its life.
Overclockers generally don't care about the life of their components, as they upgrade regularly, they use water cooling to maintain a higher overclock which would not be possible due to heat on air. Purely for getting the most out of their chips, not to make them last longer.
 
Overclockers generally don't care about the life of their components, as they upgrade regularly, they use water cooling to maintain a higher overclock which would not be possible due to heat on air. Purely for getting the most out of their chips, not to make them last longer.

why overclocking?
when overclockers investing more on cooling the computer case while risking to shorten the lifetime of a processor, why still overclocking? the cost of that would probably be near to buying a faster non-overclock CPU , isn't it?? and it will save more trouble and headache
 
why overclocking?
when overclockers investing more on cooling the computer case while risking to shorten the lifetime of a processor, why still overclocking? the cost of that would probably be near to buying a faster non-overclock CPU , isn't it?? and it will save more trouble and headache
Many people buy high end CPUs and get more out of them, where the next step up would be one of the $1,000 extreme processors. I agree though, spending hundreds of dollars to overclock an i5 is pointless IMO.
 
Many people buy high end CPUs and get more out of them, where the next step up would be one of the $1,000 extreme processors. I agree though, spending hundreds of dollars to overclock an i5 is pointless IMO.

Yeah, but if you have an i7 5960X like many people on overclock.net, you definitely want to overclpck
 
Yeah, but if you have an i7 5960X like many people on overclock.net, you definitely want to overclpck
That's what I'm saying, people buy the moderately high end CPUs with the intent to overclock, but it would be pretty pointless to buy an i3/i5 or low end i7 and spend hundreds on cooling.
 
That's what I'm saying, people buy the moderately high end CPUs with the intent to overclock, but it would be pretty pointless to buy an i3/i5 or low end i7 and spend hundreds on cooling.

Especially when you can usually get ~1GHz overclock on a £30 cooler like mine with an i5 2500K. :cool:
 
Overclocking decreases the life of the computer, that's common knowledge. Yes, putting on a really nice custom loop will lower the heat hugely, maintaining the life of the chip, but the power draw the chip now requires still has a significant negative impact on its life.

Again. Nonsense. Heat is not the issue, but power and temperature cycling. Do some research.

Heat (ie transfer of energy) and temperature nominal are very small considerations compared to activation energy and thermal cycling. You could run a CPU at a higher temperature constant and it would last longer than a lower temperature cycled. Research Arrhenius equation and compare it to an acceleration curve (Coffin-Manson equation).
 
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Again. Nonsense. Heat is not the issue, but power and temperature cycling. Do some research.

Heat (ie transfer of energy) and temperature nominal are very small considerations compared to activation energy and thermal cycling. You could run a CPU at a higher temperature constant and it would last longer than a lower temperature cycled. Research Arrhenius equation and compare it to an acceleration curve (Coffin-Manson equation).

Heat is an issue. If you don't believe me, replace your heatsink with a fanless low profile one. Don't worry, it won't reach the temperature where the chip shuts itself off, it'll be a comfortable 70C or so. But that's okay, because you're not overclocking it, right? So heat won't be a concern... [/sarcasm]

Your equations are irrelevant to this situation. They're neat... but irrelevant.
The Coffin-Manson equation is an equation from the 1950's characterizing cracks in macro-scale metal, chiefly solder joints. We're not talking about solder joints here, boards barely have any (if any) solder joints on them considering most of the components are IC's. That equation is not designed to hold up at the micro or nano scale.

oh wait, what's this...? Oh! I found the page that oke was looking at: http://www.ami.ac.uk/courses/topics/0163_ettf/

Odd, it agrees with me!

"As the peak temperature increases, the number of cycles to failure reduces very markedly " - Peak temp increases, lifetime decreases
"As the temperature range of the cycle increases, the number of cycles to failure will decrease rapidly." - Wider range of temperatures, consistent with weak cooling, causes lifetime decrease

"You could run a CPU at a higher temperature constant and it would last longer than a lower temperature cycled."

I could what? A constant is a constant, it's consistent with the materials used. It doesn't change if you change the temperature.
 
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All relating to the cycling. Its funny how you think you're right when you're not. The key is cycle. If you don't cycle it, it doesn't matter what temperature you are running it at within designed specification because in the calculation the division of T1 and T2 will always = 1. So back to the original point, the crapware will make no difference whatsoever on MTBF of electronics. None.
 
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while the most common interpretation for i3 is it's for document and NOT for gaming and i7 is mainly for gaming. What is i5 for?

And there are a lot of different speeds on i3 ,i5 or i7, what do I have to consider on that aspect when buying a new PC
 
while the most common interpretation for i3 is it's for document and NOT for gaming and i7 is mainly for gaming. What is i5 for?

And there are a lot of different speeds on i3 ,i5 or i7, what do I have to consider on that aspect when buying a new PC
i5 and i7 are great for gaming. The i5 is best if you are on a relatively low budget, if you can afford the i7 go for it. The faster speed i5/i7, the better it will perform.
 
while the most common interpretation for i3 is it's for document and NOT for gaming and i7 is mainly for gaming. What is i5 for?

And there are a lot of different speeds on i3 ,i5 or i7, what do I have to consider on that aspect when buying a new PC

i5 and i7 are great for gaming. The i5 is best if you are on a relatively low budget, if you can afford the i7 go for it. The faster speed i5/i7, the better it will perform.

Kind off-topic but I'm running an I3 and gaming ok. I'm running Far Cry 4 on medium specs. (6GB Ram and HD 7850)
 
Kind off-topic but I'm running an I3 and gaming ok. I'm running Far Cry 4 on medium specs. (6GB Ram and HD 7850)
A Pentium Dual-Core or Core 2 Duo will also be okay for gaming, but the i5/i7 are the best for gaming.
 
All relating to the cycling. Its funny how you think you're right when you're not. The key is cycle. If you don't cycle it, it doesn't matter what temperature you are running it at within designed specification because in the calculation the division of T1 and T2 will always = 1. So back to the original point, the crapware will make no difference whatsoever on MTBF of electronics. None.

Hm... still no references that are appropriate to electronics. Seems like speculation.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat

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http://www.apiste-global.com/enc/technology_enc/detail/id=1262

Oooh sources galore

Welcome to Computers.
 
Yup, both those videos presented info that supported your premise that a cpu running a few degrees warmer (but still within the designed temperature range) due to additional processes (crapware) will have a significantly reduced life. NOT! Both discussed keeping temps reduced to safe operating level. Nobody is arguing that overheating damages components but unless the crapware is somehow causing EXCESSIVE temps, then it really has no effect on the lifetime of the device.
 
Yup, both those videos presented info that supported your premise that a cpu running a few degrees warmer (but still within the designed temperature range) due to additional processes (crapware) will have a significantly reduced life. NOT! Both discussed keeping temps reduced to safe operating level. Nobody is arguing that overheating damages components but unless the crapware is somehow causing EXCESSIVE temps, then it really has no effect on the lifetime of the device.

Heat goes up, life goes down as illustrated by both videos and the links provided. Doesn't have to be a two year penalty for it to be significant enough to mention. Literally the first thing the engineering guy said was that heat degrades performance and reliability. He didn't say "Well as long as it's within the specified operating temperature, it will have absolutely no effect at all". This is basic heat and entropy!
I don't even understand the argument from your perspectives. For one, you're arguing that crapware is fine to keep on your computer.
I don't even see the motivation for Oke's disagreement, as I've not disagreed with the fact that temperature cycling is very significant.
Heat will degrade all conventional electronics, through lowering the life of the machine and through reducing the performance of it. Obviously if you have crapware kept on your computer, especially the "updated" stuff, you're going to see noticeably higher temperatures which degrade the chip in the long run and degrade its performance in the short-term. Paired with the chip being busy running the crapware, the machine will more quickly be deemed unfit for use earlier.
 
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